How do I restore the old Launchpad in macOS Tahoe

wiggle321 wrote:

Weird hill to die on, to claim that this:

What's even weirder is the apparent need to get me to agree that you're right, that your preferences is thesuperior one.

And spotlight is useless to me I literally turned off the shortcut first thing. But that's completely irrelevant. They could remove spotlight and I wouldn't notice cos I almost never touch it. But that would be a weird and childish thing for me to say if spotlight was taken away and folks were upset that their workflows were gone, right? My not using it doesn't mean it isn't central in other people's workflows. My not using it wouldn't prove anything.

And that is exactly what I said about LaunchPad. It's useless to me but I'm not judging other people's feelings about it. So, it appears we agree on something.

I said on iOS, on your phone. That's how people use/d launchpad. It's near identical how iOS (pre-widget iOS, that is). You drag the apps into the order you want, there's pages you swipe between, you create named folders.

On my iPhone, I have two pages of apps. They are the ones I use multiple times in a day. They are not in folders. I find folders cumbersome and I don't use them. For apps that aren't on my Home Screen, can you guess what I use? Yes, Spotlight.

Yep I agree that it's not objectively better than any other workflow someone uses. But you also wont even admit that it's better than a workaround alias folder, so here we are.

Again, trying to get me to "admit" that you're preference is the best, most logical one is a non-starter.

so then you understand why people who barely touch spotlight and used this every day might also be devastated, right? Cos you understand that it's not at all about objectivity (I wholly agree with you there) but about what people's preferred method was. For the individual, that IS what was best for them.

Of course, I understand. I never said otherwise.

A UI should be diverse, with several paths to fundamental actions because it is simply not possible to make one objectively best. The big icons are good for the visually impaired. And for people who think more in visuals (ie they remember an app by the icon or where they placed it or by themed grouping more than by name), or whose use is more trackpad-heavy. Or who are disabled and struggle with the keyboard. Or who dislike a cluttered dock and do not keep anything pinned so Launchpad was a good 'frequently used' place. For those uses, it could be 'objectively' (in quote marks, because it's for their individual use, which.. the word for that is subjective) better.

Apple is never going to please everyone all the time. So, wisely, they don't try.

Equally, lots of reasons could be given for spotlight being 'superior' for others. Not having to leave the keyboard, for starters. I'm sure there's more tho since I don't use it idk, but there's likely unique workflows that couldn't easily be replaced.

That's when it's time to develop new workflows.

Tho actually, I'm curious what those are, what am I missing out on just using regular old finder search?

I'm not the person to answer that, as Spotlight is the only search method I use. It's easy to access quickly (command - space). And it can be accessed from anywhere, not just Finder. With applications, it usually gets it right with two or three letters. Then all I have to do is press enter. I would be sad if Apple removed it, but, as with everything else Apple changes, within a month or so, I'd have adapted to its replacement and mostly forgotten about it. I prefer not wasting my time worrying about what used to be. Instead, I try to make the best use of the tools I have now. But that's just me.

What's even weirder is the apparent need to get me to agree that you're right, that your preferences is thesuperior one.

? I did no such thing? There were two options, one of them required fewer inputs, only one tap, and less precise cursor movement. Those are objectively advantages, but that was only comparing launchpad to the workaround suggested, absolutely NOT comparing launchpad to spotlight.

And that is exactly what I said about LaunchPad. It's useless to me but I'm not judging other people's feelings about it. So, it appears we agree on something.

you're right, but you're here arguing technicalities with people who are simply upset that the thing the like is gone. Like if if your child lost their teddy would you say well pff that wasn't the best teddy so why the long face?

Again, trying to get me to "admit" that you're preference is the best, most logical one is a non-starter.

idk how I could've made it made it any more clear that that's not what I was doing. The only claim I made is that a thing that requires two clicks and more precise targeting is "clunkier". I suppose the proper way to phrase that would be that it requires more fine motor skills and more user inputs.

Apple is never going to please everyone all the time. So, wisely, they don't try.

until there's enough of a stink and they put it back. We will see if that happens or not.

On my iPhone, I have two pages of apps.

yeah, very similar on my launchpad layout. I use mostly first page (does have some folders), and anything else is either already in the dock or I search (within launchpad).

But that's just me.

yes, exactly. It sounds like you expect everyone to be as adaptable as you are.

funnily enough, the simple global shortcut is why I turned it off. It kept interfering with shortcuts in apps I use for work. obvi could've assigned a different one so I'm not complaining, just never bothered. I just today asked a friend why they like spotlight and they said spotlight finds the thing they wrote from remembering a phrase, if they're not sure where it was. But doesn't finder search do the same? Ah, but not for, say, Mail? I'm sure there's a difference. To be clear this is NOT me ragging on spotlight, just me trying to see if there's something useful there that I might want to try out.

ah I see. Btw, maybe you can help me, things don't appear in threads on this forum, and comments don't seem to appear in order? Makes it hard to keep track. For instance I can scroll up and see you say "Or, your mother was mistaken." but no context. Just as an example, same for any other comment. Sometimes there's a "ah that solves it thanks!" reply and I can't trace it back. Yes, there's a "[timestamp] in response to [user] link, but this goes to the bottom of the page, which may contain multiple comments by that person. Is there a trick to this?

wiggle321 wrote:

ah I see. Btw, maybe you can help me, things don't appear in threads on this forum, and comments don't seem to appear in order? Makes it hard to keep track. For instance I can scroll up and see you say "Or, your mother was mistaken." but no context. Just as an example, same for any other comment. Sometimes there's a "ah that solves it thanks!" reply and I can't trace it back. Yes, there's a "[timestamp] in response to [user] link, but this goes to the bottom of the page, which may contain multiple comments by that person. Is there a trick to this?

The default sort is by Rank, meaning Apple's algorithm. You can change that to temporal, e.g. Newest.

You can also go to your profile (click on your 'avatar', generic in your case, in the upper right), then click Edit Profile & Preferences and scroll down to Other Preferences where you can set a Default Sort option that applies when you are logged in.

wiggle321 wrote:

What's even weirder is the apparent need to get me to agree that you're right, that your preferences is thesuperior one.

? I did no such thing? There were two options, one of them required fewer inputs, only one tap, and less precise cursor movement. Those are objectively advantages, but that was only comparing launchpad to the workaround suggested, absolutely NOT comparing launchpad to spotlight.

That's exactly what you're doing. You're asking me to say that LaunchPad is objectively better than the current "Apps." I maintain that it is a matter of personal preference.

MacBook Pro macOS 20.01

I want my Mac to work for ME and with ME. Taking away the Launchpad has been a step back. How do I get my Launchpad back?

However, I do appreciate the colors added back to my folders. Those little dots were terrible for quick visual perception..

JF10752 wrote:

Have they fixed this yet? Every SINGLE TIME I GO TO LAUNCH AN APPLICATION I GET ANGRY.

In my years of teaching people how to use technology, both professionally and as a hobby, I've learned a number of important lessons. One of the most significant is that it's very hard to learn new skills or information if you're angry. Once upon a time, you learned how to use LaunchPad. You can learn how to use Apps (or Spotlight). But you do have to make the effort. The anger only hurts you.

My personal opinion is that LaunchPad is not coming back. But you should still submit feedback. I could well be wrong.

"Don't sweat the small stuff...and it's all small stuff." - Richard Carlson

This isn't about learning new skills. He's quite capable of using Apps or Spotlight. He's angry because it's annoying to have to go hunt for an app, when you previously had it in front of you in milliseconds with the flick of a mouse.

He's annoyed because he had organized his apps in launchpad, over years and years of use, in locations and groups that made sense to him and then Apple suddenly waltzed into his life and rearranged everything--without even asking for anyone's input.

It's one thing for upper management to replace the inboxes on your desk, whiteboard on your wall and filing cabinet with brand new equipment. It's completely absurd to walk into work one day and find out they've moved them to the office next-door, so every time you need to use them, you have to get up and walk 25 feet. Especially when you're one of the people who uses those all day long.

Telling that guy that he will better learn how to use the file cabinet next-door when he isn't angry anymore, isn't helpful. He knows how to use the file cabinet. He's angry because the new process completely interrupts his workflow.

Apple could easily bring back launch pad and make it optional in settings. Or, they could allow third party apps to use the hot corners. Either of those solutions would be acceptable.

Hopefully, Apple will come to the realization that "Apps" is useless because users already could search for their apps way more efficiently using Spotlight. It's way more efficient to use the same process for all your searches... I doubt any avid Spotlight users will even use "Apps." It's a place-holder for novice users. Whereas LaunchPad provided a different functionality that many users depended on.

Advanced users learned to pair it with a hot-corner and it was the fastest solution for opening apps. They are the ones who are most affected by this and the loudest voices protesting the change.

baneyw wrote:

He's angry because it's annoying to have to go hunt for an app, when you previously had it in front of you in milliseconds with the flick of a mouse.

Many people find change annoying.

He's annoyed because he had organized his apps in launchpad, over years and years of use, in locations and groups that made sense to him and then Apple suddenly waltzed into his life and rearranged everything--without even asking for anyone's input.

Fair point, as long as you keep in mind that Apple doesn’t force anyone to upgrade to a new version of macOS. Developer betas then public betas come out long before the official release of a new macOS. I have never used Launchpad, but I knew it was gone from Tahoe before I upgraded (which I did on launch day).

Apple could easily bring back launch pad and make it optional in settings. Or, they could allow third party apps to use the hot corners. Either of those solutions would be acceptable.

They could. Posting such requests here is as effective as whispering them aloud in an empty room.

Hopefully, Apple will come to the realization that "Apps" is useless because users already could search for their apps way more efficiently using Spotlight.

Apps is effectively a shortcut to Spotlight’s apps pane. Launchpad was an app, so Apple replaced it with another app. Presumably many people kept Launchpad in the Dock (where it was by default), and accessed it from there, so a replacement app is anything but useless to some.

It's way more efficient to use the same process for all your searches... I doubt any avid Spotlight users will even use "Apps." It's a place-holder for novice users.

So novice users don’t matter? Mmmmkay.

Whereas LaunchPad provided a different functionality that many users depended on.

Indeed. And many users couldn’t care less about it.

Advanced users learned to pair it with a hot-corner and it was the fastest solution for opening apps.

As an advanced user, I find the Dock is the fastest solution for opening apps. Hot corner with Launchpad is move cursor to corner, move cursor back then click. Dock is move cursor to Dock then click. One move and a click is faster than two moves and a click. No advanced math required to count the steps.

They are the ones who are most affected by this and the loudest voices protesting the change.

If a tree falls in the woods, will Apple hear it?

Do you dump all of your silverware into a drawer and search for them? Or do you separate them so you can visually locate them and find them? Muscle memory task can be very quick if you do something enough times. To me all I see is just a giant drawer with stuff just dumped into it with no organization. When things are in folders and you only have one hand free to use a mouse it makes it super easy to navigate. Now if you just want to use the mouse you have to scroll and hunt for the app you are looking for.

baneyw wrote:

This isn't about learning new skills. He's quite capable of using Apps or Spotlight. He's angry because it's annoying to have to go hunt for an app, when you previously had it in front of you in milliseconds with the flick of a mouse.

I'm sorry. I didn't realize that poster was a personal friend of yours. I can't figure out any other way you would actually know so much about what they are thinking based on such a short post.

He's annoyed because he had organized his apps in launchpad, over years and years of use, in locations and groups that made sense to him and then Apple suddenly waltzed into his life and rearranged everything--without even asking for anyone's input.

Apple does ask for input. It's called the Public Beta.

Apple could easily bring back launch pad and make it optional in settings. Or, they could allow third party apps to use the hot corners. Either of those solutions would be acceptable.

As it is unlikely that they will do that, my advice address the actual issue as it is now, not a vain hope for the future.

Hopefully, Apple will come to the realization that "Apps" is useless because users already could search for their apps way more efficiently using Spotlight. It's way more efficient to use the same process for all your searches... I doubt any avid Spotlight users will even use "Apps." It's a place-holder for novice users. Whereas LaunchPad provided a different functionality that many users depended on.

Yes, Spotlight is, in my opinion, the fastest way. But that's just my opinion. Unlike you, I don't presume to speak for other people.

Advanced users learned to pair it with a hot-corner and it was the fastest solution for opening apps. They are the ones who are most affected by this and the loudest voices protesting the change.

Again, the speaking for other people... Speaking as an "advanced user," I think hot corners are a waste of time. They require that I remove my fingers from the keyboard. Spotlight does not. I know a lot of the "advanced users" on this forum. Very few of them are protesting this, either because they don't care or because they've submitted their feedback in the appropriate way and have moved on.

But again, what I like or what you presume everyone likes is irrelevant. "Apps" and Spotlight are what Apple offers now. People either need to learn to use it or they need to find a third-party option they like. Staying angry about it serves no useful purpose.

zZKableZz wrote:

Do you dump all of your silverware into a drawer and search for them? Or do you separate them so you can visually locate them and find them?

If Spotlight could find them and hand them to me, I would. But physical objects are not digital information. The analogy is specious.

Muscle memory task can be very quick if you do something enough times. To me all I see is just a giant drawer with stuff just dumped into it with no organization. When things are in folders and you only have one hand free to use a mouse it makes it super easy to navigate. Now if you just want to use the mouse you have to scroll and hunt for the app you are looking for.

So tell Apple:

Product Feedback - Apple

I don't fit all my apps on the Dock, nor would I want to do so. My dock has 27 apps on it, and those are the ones I use >95% of the time. I have room for a few more when using the internal display on my 16" MBP (top), and room for a whole lot more when using my ultrawide 5K:2K display (bottom).

My Applications folder has 107 apps in it, and Launchpad is limited to showing 35 of them at a time...that means I would need 4 panes in Launchpad to access all of my apps. On the rare occasions when I need to open an app that's not on the Dock, I simply press Command-Shift-A and that shortcut opens the Applications folder, which is sorted by name in List view. Very easy to open any less commonly accessed app I need, and in a way that is faster than swiping to the 3rd or 4th pane of apps in Launchpad.

Having said that, I do sympathize with those who relied on Launchpad. I would not be happy if Apple took away the Dock and Launchpad was the only way to launch apps. But I like to think that I'd adapt.

Well, that's certainly not faster than Launchpad with a hot corner. You said the dock was the fastest way to launch apps. What about all those apps that don't fit on the dock?

Oh, you thought you were telling us something we don't already know?

Of course we put our most frequently used apps on the dock. Did you think otherwise? Like, maybe we deleted all the apps from the dock? Really?

We arranged our other apps in Launch Pad. We used folders to organize them. The apps we used the most were located nearest the hot corner we assigned inside Launch Pad, where it was most convenient. The apps we used less frequently were stored elsewhere, or in folders with related apps.

Many of us, also used spotlight search when our hands were on the keyboard. The problem is when we are performing (often many many repeated) functions when they are not.

I perform a lot of functions on my Mac that only require a mouse. One of those functions requires frequent screenshots. I use the screenshot app for that. I don't want to have to reach over to my keyboard every time I want to launch the screenshot app. Mouse/Keyboard Mouse/Keyboard/etc. I also don't want to store it on the dock, because it's just one of many workflows for me. I have better uses for the dock space. Same with utilities like Speedtest. I'm not storing that on my dock. But I use it all the time.

In 2011, assigning Launch Pad to a hot corner was a very popular idea. Many users like me have been using it ever since. Apparently you never discovered the beauty of this little hack. Whether or not you ever discovered it, doesn't make much difference. But if you've never discovered or used it, your opinion of it is meaningless. But just so you know: It was, in fact, the best and fastest mouse-only way to launch apps. Used when your hands are performing mouse or trackpad functions.

Also, your opinion of whether Apple will or will not bring back Launchpad is meaningless. They've brought back many nixed features before. If enough users express discontent with this decision, they will bring it back. Whatever that number is--and there is a number.

Also, your opinion of the merits of discussing this issue in this support forum is meaningless. Yes, many of us know that Apple may or may not see this discussion, or act upon the contents of it. The responses here are extremely helpful for people like me who went searching to find out if there was a way to replace Launch Pad in macOS Tahoe. They apparently aren't useful to you, so I don't know why you're even here??? Perhaps you just mosey along and mind your own business.

So you operate your computer/laptop without looking at it? It doesn’t matter if it’s digital or physical. When things are presented to you. You look at it (unless you are blind and use accessibility options) and interact with it. The physical mouse is not going to move itself. The physical keyboard isn’t going to type itself.